Reta question

[Thegodofgains]

Reading that and putting together your statement about dieting @Thegodofgains, it looks like you have a tendency to depend on the drugs to avoid the hard lifting.
If you actually followed through with what you wrote , what did you gain from it other than organs screaming for help. Did you compete somewhere in there?
That's awfully aggressive for just being a casual gym bro, hell it's a lot for an amateur competitor.

@Thegodofgains - around a year ago - you had a 12 month plan as it would be done around now (below) If you wonder why do I remember 12 months ago - it stood out like someone who was really pushing their luck as you already had fatty liver and you were using some of the harshest steroids:

3rd Recomp Cycle
Start: 01/13/25
End: 05/12/25
T = 795 T400 0.6
Tr = 285 0.4 Tren E/0.1 TNT
EQ = 180 0.2
M = 120 0.2
N = 75 0.1
Adrol = 175 (1-6) (stop 03/03/25)
Avar = 140 (7-12) (stop 04/14/25)
Total = 1455-1595-1630
Total = 1.6 x 3 = 4.8
_______________________________________
4th Recomp Cycle
Start Date: 05/14/25
End Date: 09/03/25
T = 795 T400 0.6
Tr = 285 0.4 Tren E/0.1 TNT
EQ = 180 0.2
M = 120 0.2
N = 75 0.1
Adrol = 175 (1-6)
Avar = 140 (7-12)
Total = 1455-1595-1630
Total = 1.6 x 3 = 4.8
_______________________________________
5th Recomp Cycle
Start Date: 09/05/25
End Date: 12/26/25
T = 720 T400 0.6
Tr = 240 0.4 Tren E
EQ = 180 0.2
M = 120 0.2
N = 75 0.1
Sdrol = 70 (1-7)
Adrol = 175 (8-9)
Avar = 140 (10-11)
Total = 1335-1405-1475-1510
Total = 1.5 x 3 = 4.5cc week

Did you do this and if so, did you finish with too much body fat? I am trying to recall correct as I did not read the entire thread from a year ago, but I think your goal was just to be a freak, not competing, no power lifting, etc. My memory isn't as good as used to be.
Looking back you asked questions about BP supplements (mentions you have two on hand if needed), fatty liver issues (no comment on protective supplements that I recall), insomnia and so on. Just curious as I am trying to help and really can't without knowing some of the history as you disappeared for about 5 months. Off topic but Reta is being studied as a script med for fatty liver which will be the first one if approved and prescribed for this disease. Albeit, it will do crap if your NAFLD is caused by your diet and you don't change your ways.

Hard to fathom if you took high doses of Test, tren, Boldenone, Masteron, Nandrolone - to mask joint paid if I recall your wording correct, S drol, Adrol, Oxandrolone (No mention of ancillaries - did you make it a year with no assistance needed for estrogen or prolactin?). Not sure how you would and could contribute to retaining water, hormonal inbalances, etc. I think you mentioned you relied on test, tren, and orals for size.
I find some of your numbers hard to follow. You list .6 of T400 on different cycles = different amounts. To get to 795 or 720 you need more than .6 (if going my ML's - even 1.6 does not equal your numbers) - please explain. Same with Nandrolone 75 mg - you mention .1 - is it dosed to 750 mg/ML? Seriously, trying to understand those numbers.

thank you - it will be easier for people to help you if members know the background of your usage and what you accomplished on a year straight of a large amount of steroids, especially orals. Do what you like, but I will repeat my comment - 3 months of high dose orals three times in a year, are not a good idea regardless of how much you weigh.

Followed it consistently, but i look like a full blown bodybuilder off season before he begins a prep. Like a water buffalo guest posing. Because it's my first time reaching that weight and look. I don't drink so it's not a dad bob at all. But i did gain body fat definitely.

I had ancillaries just didn't write it down when I made that post.

The numbers I'm not going to explain I have t400 and high concentrate brews. It's exactly as written.

I also did reduce the total amount to 1 gram for the past 3 months

The orals at lower dose 25mg adrol or 20ng avar, or 10mg sdrol (still strong) were not taken at the same time, but switched it every 4 weeks. I used it more for pre workout reasons and did get crazy pumps. It's quick way to just increase total anabolic load rather than increasing injectables and pinning calves if I run out of space and scar tissue builds etc. That's the reason I made for taking orals that long.

But I did realize for my next cycles I'm going to stop the orals. But because I have it in just going to finish it.

Still getting blood work done and donating blood.

I know I kept just consuming calories and protein fats and carbs, but that's why I workout training max 1.5 hours supersets etc because if I didn't it would all be 320-330lbs of fat + water. So the stuff I taken definitely pushed it into muscular size/girth. But there is layers of fat/water on top when relaxed.

This is when I realized I need to drop fat. But in conclusion I got massive. Hard to put socks on big or cut my nails big.

I do lift hard. Trust me. I just have a hard time cutting weight that's it or suffering for it. I do have a binge eating disorder. I blame Goku from Dragonball and other real psychological reasons.

Like, 2 years ago I had more control over my diet was 220lbs as I was in a different environment where my mind was preoccupied with tasks.

Also since I made this post/thread, I have made slight changes to meal portions sizes, drinking more fluids at night, just shutting my mind to go to sleep.

So another thing, is I eat late at night, not because I'm even hungry. Its so I can get the carbsomia and just drop into a sleep coma.

I know that by just changing this one thing it'll be a big difference, so I'm working at it seriously because I know it's been wrecking me, and it will definitely wreck me worse sooner or later if I don't change it.

And as for blood work etc, the thing that made markers more out of wack is eating junk processed food on top of everything. It's a insane multiplier for negative outcomes

LIke when I realized how bad junk food is, which I realized now, because I never did a dirty bulk. Ever. First time is pretty much what I did in the past year. Things got worse from junk eating

What did I learn from this.

Personal experience

Don't take sdrol and tren.
Do 1 or the other. Not at the same time.

Tren causes more mental issues. What i mean is a certain uneasyness.

Me and nandrolones don't work well either.

Test + EQ or Mast I feel healthier and I guess because I don't have libido issues I get from nandrolone derivatives I feel more confident.

I get hair loss and shedding regardless what hormone I'm on. Once I go supra physiological I'm going to lose a lot of hair.

Junk food wrecks blood work more than anything else I've taken in past 10 years. I have 50-55 pages of blood work.

I do have red yeast rice to control bad cholesterol.

Telmisartan @ 20mg ED

Propranolol 20mg when needed.

Don't drink, smoke, but love food.

 

[Trenbolone&Cheese]

so just to understand, what was your diet on this recomp cycle? surely in a deficit and letting all those drugs do the lifting as far as anti-catabolism + probable hypertrophy even in a slight deficit considering you say bf% was high. otherwise was this just a prolonged growth phase and not a true recomp?

what about cardio? high volume workouts and cardio are not the same imo. 30 minutes on a bike i can easily burn 300-400 calories while watching a video, no one is burning that amount of calories in an hour or 2 of lifting while also getting the best stimulus possible for hypertrophy.

what were your starting stats for weight + estimated BF%? do you have it logged somewhere before and after each consecutive blast? do you track progressive overload?

sorry a lot of questions but i don’t recall reading them in this thread, haven’t gone back but have been following it

 

[Goldenrod]

Reading that and putting together your statement about dieting @Thegodofgains, it looks like you have a tendency to depend on the drugs to avoid the hard lifting.
If you actually followed through with what you wrote , what did you gain from it other than organs screaming for help. Did you compete somewhere in there?
That's awfully aggressive for just being a casual gym bro, hell it's a lot for an amateur competitor.

That is where I was going @Rhyno - I read the year long cycle and large amounts of PED's and it is irrelevant if you don't take all the orals at once, you are essentially on an oral for a year straight. Most of the sage members here use them for a month to tighten up and cut a little at the end, some start with an oral as a boost or do it mid-cycle. In order to provide any help, they have to read back to see the PED abuse. Exception being guys who compete may need specific orals for a longer time or so it appears from the coaches I know.


@Thegodofgains - considering you have a damaged liver already, orals should be off the table but have you had an ultrasound and did the doctors tell you it has not progressed and again, fatty liver is nothing to worry about? The good news is the liver can heal to some degree but if it could heal from everything, alcoholics would not get fatty liver, cirrhosis, or liver cancer over time. Which drink was it that tipped the scale - who knows. The same can be said for steroids especially C-17a alkalyted orals. Taking the harshest injectable - tren, and the harshest oral - Superdrol (people can argue that statement, but Superdrol has put more in the ICU than any steroid I know of).
Just my take, but clearly I am more conservative. I am writing this as I don't want to see you disappear and injure your body. Further, if you have eating issues - as in unhealthy food or too much, that will put more stress on your organs.

Best of luck with the Reta and hope it heals your liver, if it does please let us know if the fatty infiltration disappears.

 

[Thegodofgains]

That is where I was going @Rhyno - I read the year long cycle and large amounts of PED's and it is irrelevant if you don't take all the orals at once, you are essentially on an oral for a year straight. Most of the sage members here use them for a month to tighten up and cut a little at the end, some start with an oral as a boost or do it mid-cycle. In order to provide any help, they have to read back to see the PED abuse. Exception being guys who compete may need specific orals for a longer time or so it appears from the coaches I know.


@Thegodofgains - considering you have a damaged liver already, orals should be off the table but have you had an ultrasound and did the doctors tell you it has not progressed and again, fatty liver is nothing to worry about? The good news is the liver can heal to some degree but if it could heal from everything, alcoholics would not get fatty liver, cirrhosis, or liver cancer over time. Which drink was it that tipped the scale - who knows. The same can be said for steroids especially C-17a alkalyted orals. Taking the harshest injectable - tren, and the harshest oral - Superdrol (people can argue that statement, but Superdrol has put more in the ICU than any steroid I know of).
Just my take, but clearly I am more conservative. I am writing this as I don't want to see you disappear and injure your body. Further, if you have eating issues - as in unhealthy food or too much, that will put more stress on your organs.

Best of luck with the Reta and hope it heals your liver, if it does please let us know if the fatty infiltration disappears.

I don't think I have a permanently damaged liver. It took a beating for sure, but my bile duct is perfect whilst on cycle. there's AST, ALT and then the G. The G test is perfect.

I have elevated liver enzymes when I'm on orals. It goes back down when I'm off.

There was a 4 week break where I didn't take any orals. Just couldn't be bothered because, like I said earlier in one of the posts., "don't run tren or sdrol together", so in that 4 week, I just did injectables and got blood work after 4 weeks and liver enzymes returned to normal ranges.

So it's the start of the new year, and I completed that plan. I do have orals left over, but now I may use it only using it on training days or just take a break and then use it like I did last year, much later in this year.

 

[Goldenrod]

I don't think I have a permanently damaged liver. It took a beating for sure, but my bile duct is perfect whilst on cycle. there's AST, ALT and then the G. The G test is perfect.

I have elevated liver enzymes when I'm on orals. It goes back down when I'm off.

There was a 4 week break where I didn't take any orals. Just couldn't be bothered because, like I said earlier in one of the posts., "don't run tren or sdrol together", so in that 4 week, I just did injectables and got blood work after 4 weeks and liver enzymes returned to normal ranges.

So it's the start of the new year, and I completed that plan. I do have orals left over, but now I may use it only using it on training days or just take a break and then use it like I did last year, much later in this year.

OK - is the G test GGT? I am done commenting as I don't think it is sinking in and it is your choice. "Your bile duct is perfect" - if you mean your bile ducts are working properly so your liver transports bile properly for digestion, breaking down fat, and removing waste that is good.

I will leave you with a medical fact to try to put what I am saying in to perspective. Do as you wish, but I am saying this because I do not want you to experience liver damage. If you get bad liver damage you will be constantly covering your body with lotion for the itching and they will force you to take lactulose every hour and you will be a diaper so when you shit yourself constantly, the nurses can change you. Not an exaggeration - every friend I know that is an alcoholic or abused drugs to an extreme and had liver damage and had to be hospitalized, would refuse the lactulose as it the only way the doctors can try to help you body rid the body of toxins - defecate constantly to remove the toxins and hope your liver heals.

I hate to tell you but unless your fatty liver has repaired (which is very unlikely based on your PED usage), you have permanent liver damage. If you stop stressing it and help it heal, it may and may never again. Most hepatologists will state your liver has be have 70-75% significant damage before you will have any symptoms or issues. The liver is resilient - no argument. You can feel wonderful and have great workouts with a very stressed liver. I know this first hand and that is after healing my fatty liver.
How many alcoholics end up with progressive fatty liver, cirrhosis, or liver cancer - most at some point. Some work full jobs sober but they binge drink on the weekends or a few days a week. If you were to take blood tests while binge drinking your GGT, most likely ALT, AST, and ALP would be significantly elevated. Your body will process the alcohol quickly and before you start your next binge - get blood tests and they could all be normal unless you have permanent damage starting and at that point you will notice some anomalies with ALT, AST, and ALP (GGT is an indicator of fatty liver and acute stress, one or two alcoholic drinks or a Tylenol will increase it) - there are more detailed liver blood tests when a doctor sees chronic issues, but there is no sense going into those.
I hear you, and most people think that way - if I recovered then I didn't do any damage. You may not know until years down the road, especially if you keep stressing an organ. Some people can take a lot of PED's and their liver seems to be made of iron, maybe you are one of those folks. Good that you get blood tests done. As I said - do what you wish but I would not be OK with elevated liver enzymes for any amount of time. If a compound causes a problem, I don't use it but I do not compete and will not get rich from using copious amounts of harsh PED's so I do not risk it, but is just one person's take. My liver damage was from Mono - a virus that decided to attack my liver. I had to wait it out and do everything I could to keep my glutathione high and inflammation down. There were no anti-viral medications offered for the virus that caused Mono as I did have the EBV or CMV. I was just one of the unlucky ones.
Wish you the best.

 

[montrealmanny]

30s gym guy here: normal labs after a break ≠ “all good,” especially with a fatty liver history. Get imaging + a proper liver workup and stop adding stressors. Biggest gains will come from nailing the night eating/sleep and staying consistent with calories/steps everything else is secondary.

Thats just my take on it.

 

[bigshape35]

At 320–330 lbs, the biggest win you can buy isn’t a “perfect protocol,” it’s consistency. GLP/GIP/GCGR meds (like reta is being researched as) don’t “burn fat” directly like a stimulant they mainly work by reducing appetite/food noise and helping people sustain a calorie deficit. That’s why some people see huge results and others feel “meh” it depends on whether it actually changes your intake and adherence.


A few factual points that get missed in these threads:

• Fast weight loss increases the chance of loose skin, especially starting heavier. That’s just physiology.
• GI side effects are common with this drug class (nausea, reflux, constipation/diarrhea) and they’re a major reason people quit.
• If you’ve got a history of fatty liver, the most objective way to track that isn’t “enzymes looked okay” — it’s imaging (ultrasound or FibroScan) plus labs. Enzymes can be normal even when fatty liver is present.
• If you’re already admitting binge eating / late-night eating, the highest ROI move is addressing that loop (sleep hygiene + structured meals + a plan for cravings). The drug can help, but it won’t replace habits.

If you want to do this “smooth and sustainable,” the smart play is: pick a realistic deficit, do your 30 min cardio, track weekly average scale weight, and involve a clinician if you can, especially with your size and medication history. That’s what keeps you progressing without wrecking your quality of life.

Just my two cents!

 

[gondar1]

I hear you, and most people think that way - if I recovered then I didn't do any damage.

Not a shot at @Thegodofgains or anyone else, just a tag on to your post and @bigshape35 's too sorta falling into the "missed" things -
I've always been befuddled by the way most people time blood work. Seems like more often they are done after coming off. I do them then too but I prioritize looking at the results that bring sides to be done at peak cycle time.
2 more cents, more sense?

 

[kickoverload]

The recommended dose is likely going to 8-10 mg per week over two doses. I have been running it as a bit of an experiment and tritated it from very low up to 10 mg per week.

10 mg a week is hard on the system. You go between diarrhea and constipation, and it crushes appetite. It actually makes food unappealing.

I’m lowering back down to about 4-5 per week as it was effective there and almost no sides but reduced appetite.

Good to know, I might actually give it a whirl now!

 

[Goldenrod]

Not a shot at @Thegodofgains or anyone else, just a tag on to your post and @bigshape35 's too sorta falling into the "missed" things -
I've always been befuddled by the way most people time blood work. Seems like more often they are done after coming off. I do them then too but I prioritize looking at the results that bring sides to be done at peak cycle time.
2 more cents, more sense?

Hey @gondar1 - when are you saying the best time to do blood work is? To be clear - few I respect more than G1 so this is not an argument but a discussion. Interested in your opinion.
I go by a simple system - any new compound, weeks in and I will do blood work no matter how I feel. I felt great on T-bol and Oxandrolone and my liver enzymes were through the roof so glad I did. My little cycles, I do them after to see if lipids or kidney function was impacted at all, etc.
Last but not least I get yearly blood work done at the same time every year and have a medical file - if I see anomalies I look back at my journal as damage (which is a side effect), if there is any I hope I can determine the cause and fix it. Not having your own dates medical file, and list of cycles no matter how small/big they are and what you changed in your diet - don't get it, how will you know what compounds are best for you?
I think we both agree, side effects are not necessarily what you have during or right after. I recall a post I read of your where you were telling someone you don't think you have any side effects - wait a few years and you will know. It was a while ago, but it was definitely you and that was definitely you point. Please correct me if I misinterpreted your post.
Drinking alcohol and PED abuse is like radiation - will a few chest X-rays or a CT scan give you cancer, not unless you are one of the unlucky ones, but radiation has memory (ask any doctor or scientist who works with it) and the more you get over time: the higher your chances of radiation induced cell change and damage which can result in cancer. Not the best analogy but I think my point is accurate. Ironic radiation is a treatment and can cause other cancers albeit it is targeted at a specific tumour.

 

[gondar1]

Hey @gondar1 - when are you saying the best time to do blood work is? To be clear - few I respect more than G1 so this is not an argument but a discussion. Interested in your opinion.
...

I read the first sentence and started formulating an answer in my head right away. Fortunately for my frail fingers everything you wrote after that was in line with my own thoughts.
Minus practicality of cost and time spent, your model is very good IMO.
Me, bloods panel every 3-6 months for years now but hardly ever on hormones anymore. So much data piled up on that already, don't need more unless something weird happens, no new to me AAS likely in my future.
In the past and in general, very much like you, a couple weeks in on anything new and then at a later point in any particular cycle at least a few weeks after everything has peaked which depending on cycle length might be very close to the end. Then another set when off and "clear" or whenever needed to follow something up. All of that pretty much gets any yearly type of monitoring covered.

Too much! They shout from the hills. Fuck No! I shout back. We are in a really fortunate situation where we are able to get a pretty good handle on what's going on inside our bodies via bloods and other diagnostic tools. Foolish not to take advantage of that. I'm very happy that I was able to hook up with one of the best sports medicine Drs in the country when I was still in my teens. His attitude about testing informed mine, I've had some health problems but mostly trauma, not much in of the internal stuff snuck up on me. I'd bet some solid cash that I'd be dead already if I hadn't got the warnings that diagnostics provided.

BTW I got a file too, about a 1/4 of the drawer in the filing cabinet, xrays, cd's from mri's and cat scans, bloods, hardware, surgical reports. Having that shit on hand has allowed me to demonstrate to various practitioners that a push in certain areas was warranted.

And I remember that post too, nope you didn't misinterpret anything.

PS "To be clear - few I respect more than G1 so this is not an argument but a discussion. Interested in your opinion." right back at ya, I get a kick out of how you always note that ur posting to me and everyone here with respect (insert bro hug emoji), "arguments" are important, the word doesn't have to imply disrespect. The simplest definition of an argument to me is only the things that describe a point of view.