Need electrical help

[animal-inside]

With a house which is only 220 single phase you won’t really save any money.
You really can’t get a huge imbalance.

Now at the shop we have 3 phase, so 3 load lines, red, black and blue.
So if you have a couple of 220 single phase refrigeration unit hooked up to the same lines, so black and red, you’ll have an imbalance of power on the blue line.
So you try to get a couple of heavy load 120v items on the blue line to compensate.
Mind you for each red, black and blue line (or each of the 3 phases) you have 1 neutral. You have to be careful not to overload the neutral line and need to only switch the lines between the 3 phases, between the shared neutral. So you can’t have red black and blue hooked up to the same phase, because you could have to much power combing back on the neutral which could be at a higher amp value than the wire is rated for and start a fire.

Honestly I’m not sure if I’m accurate about all this, but when I told an electrician friend I was going to balance my panel, this is what he suggested. He also didn’t think I’d save money. But my thought was if you can reduce the amount of money wasted on the neutral line, up you’d be pulling in less power on the load phases. It worked, but that panel was really out of balance, like 98 amp on two phases and 20 amp on the third. So a lot of power went on the neutral, sometimes up to 60 amps.

The hardest part was getting the individual line loads. See back then all I had was a volt meter that I periodically looked at, now you can likely buy a blue tooth cell phone one that would give you a 12 hour graph or something, lol.

I'm so far from being knowledgable with anything electrical lol.. What you say makes sense though.

I really wish when I was younger I took some eletroncics classes in high school. They only offered one course in gr 11 or 12.. thats it. and I didn't take it, I chose physics instead.

mechanical stuff was sort of taught to me when I was younger and mechanical stuff just makes sense to me. I don't have the basic background knowledge in electricty to really figure out stuff that your saying. Wish it was something I learned more growing up.

 

[Sorbate]

I'm so far from being knowledgable with anything electrical lol.. What you say makes sense though.

I really wish when I was younger I took some eletroncics classes in high school. They only offered one course in gr 11 or 12.. thats it. and I didn't take it, I chose physics instead.

mechanical stuff was sort of taught to me when I was younger and mechanical stuff just makes sense to me. I don't have the basic background knowledge in electricty to really figure out stuff that your saying. Wish it was something I learned more growing up.

I was never really keen on school but very good at teaching myself with the proper resources.

 

[Heraclitus]

I was never really keen on school but very good at teaching myself with the proper resources.

Never liked school either, but always liked learning new stuff.
Brown College offered an electronics course years ago 25 years ago.
It was 5000 tuition or you could teach yourself the course from their CD for 20bucks, and then pay 5000 for a certificate.
I was satisfied with just paying the 20bucks.

Nowadays, Khan Academy has everything available for free on tons of subjects.

how much power does your shop use?
300bucks in savings is a fuckton of I2R losses. Or are they are billing you for VARs too?

 

[Sorbate]

Never liked school either, but always liked learning new stuff.
Brown College offered an electronics course years ago 25 years ago.
It was 5000 tuition or you could teach yourself the course from their CD for 20bucks, and then pay 5000 for a certificate.
I was satisfied with just paying the 20bucks.

Nowadays, Khan Academy has everything available for free on tons of subjects.

how much power does your shop use?
300bucks in savings is a fuckton of I2R losses. Or are they are billing you for VARs too?

Normal house meter.
This was my old shop, about 80 amps a leg on average. I didn’t have enough power to run everything so the roof top unit was attached to the landlords panel.
I was on a hunt to get my power below $1000. It was $1300 when I started, then I improved insulation, adjusted cooler temperatures by using gelatin on the temperature control probe, so the unit in the cooler didn’t kick on and off every time the door opened. Refrigeration is more efficient if it runs longer but less often. Even if in an hour you have the same amount of on and off time, but if it cycles on and off every 10 minutes vs runs 30 turns off 30, you will use less power. Once the liquid and gas gets moving it takes less energy to run the pump.
On both my cooler and freezer doing this saved about $100 a month.
Balancing the panel box was my last item, it was done out of desperation, in hopes. It was free.
I eventually got the power bill down to $800 and change a month without sacrificing anything.
Sometimes I get so consumed on doing something, it becomes my only focus until I achieve my goal.

The new shop has 400 amp service. We didn’t need that much but they did t make a 300 amp panel. New shop is larger and has more equipment.
My power bill is now $2000 a month, the liberals in Ontario fucked our power generation and doubled the costs.

 

[Heraclitus]

Normal house meter.
This was my old shop, about 80 amps a leg on average. I didn’t have enough power to run everything so the roof top unit was attached to the landlords panel.
I was on a hunt to get my power below $1000. It was $1300 when I started, then I improved insulation, adjusted cooler temperatures by using gelatin on the temperature control probe, so the unit in the cooler didn’t kick on and off every time the door opened. Refrigeration is more efficient if it runs longer but less often. Even if in an hour you have the same amount of on and off time, but if it cycles on and off every 10 minutes vs runs 30 turns off 30, you will use less power. Once the liquid and gas gets moving it takes less energy to run the pump.
On both my cooler and freezer doing this saved about $100 a month.
Balancing the panel box was my last item, it was done out of desperation, in hopes. It was free.
I eventually got the power bill down to $800 and change a month without sacrificing anything.
Sometimes I get so consumed on doing something, it becomes my only focus until I achieve my goal.

The new shop has 400 amp service. We didn’t need that much but they did t make a 300 amp panel. New shop is larger and has more equipment.
My power bill is now $2000 a month, the liberals in Ontario fucked our power generation and doubled the costs.

Ah. yeah that makes sense.
I figure you saved over 600 tons of worth of heat per month. I couldn't see it all coming from line losses.
Smart idea to increase the hysteresis with gelatin. Never would have though of that. Saves power and reduces wear and tear on the equipment too.

Yeah Wynn fucked over Ontario good. None of it even made any sense from a technical point of view as the wind and solar create grid instability.
and Talking about things running efficiently at steady state....Wynn had nuclear power plants de-rating every time the wind blew just so that she could say "see how much power the windmills make" The cycle cost on those turbines is in the 100's of millions. I'd like to see what the true cost of renewable is if those were added. People maybe don't even know that our tax dollars were paid to a private company to NOT make power, a bonus paid on top for the equipment damage incurred, and THEN we paid the wind producers 36cents kwh for power instead of just the 4.5cents

personally, l had just put in my own ground source heat pump as the cheapest heating option available...... 2 years later, the price doubled. Hindsight says I should have went with the wood boiler.

 

[Sorbate]

Ah. yeah that makes sense.
I figure you saved over 600 tons of worth of heat per month. I couldn't see it all coming from line losses.
Smart idea to increase the hysteresis with gelatin. Never would have though of that. Saves power and reduces wear and tear on the equipment too.

Yeah Wynn fucked over Ontario good. None of it even made any sense from a technical point of view as the wind and solar create grid instability.
and Talking about things running efficiently at steady state....Wynn had nuclear power plants de-rating every time the wind blew just so that she could say "see how much power the windmills make" The cycle cost on those turbines is in the 100's of millions. I'd like to see what the true cost of renewable is if those were added. People maybe don't even know that our tax dollars were paid to a private company to NOT make power, a bonus paid on top for the equipment damage incurred, and THEN we paid the wind producers 36cents kwh for power instead of just the 4.5cents

personally, l had just put in my own ground source heat pump as the cheapest heating option available...... 2 years later, the price doubled. Hindsight says I should have went with the wood boiler.

Lol, wood boiler. Could have likely been cheaper with a forced air wood stove.
Yeah, I’m glad I didn’t put a heat pump on my pool. Went with a 400,000 btu gas heater instead.
Now if I had ac in my house, I could have used that to heat the pool, but usually when you need ac, the pool is warm enough. So no real savings.
I was going to use the heat the pool pump motor produced but it was too much money for a water cooled motor, than what I would get in heat. I guess the motor may last longer, but for $50 I can change burned out bearings every 4 years.

I had no idea about derating the plants. But I knew the gave a ton of money to the companies to build the windmills and overpaid them for the power.
I watched a show on the economics of a windmill, and it was pretty much figured out, that even if they used all the numbers the green environmentalists use, it would still be cheaper to pay the damage climate change would bring, that the cost of the windmills, and he didn’t include the cost to the wildlife and the blades not being recyclable.

Oh and the gelatin idea wasn’t mine. A guy came in to sell me stuff to increase my power efficiency, like dc motors (15 year pay back because they are too small) and one of his ideas was to sell me a “special” meat like substitute for like $300, lol. So in my first experiment, I used actual chunks of beef and threw them out before they went bad. It worked so then I bought some gelatin that is more like bullistic gel, but more air pockets and then used that instead.

I’m not smart enough to figure out these things on my own, but I’m good at listening and bright enough to know if it may be a good idea or scam, lol.

 

[animal-inside]

Ah. yeah that makes sense.
I figure you saved over 600 tons of worth of heat per month. I couldn't see it all coming from line losses.
Smart idea to increase the hysteresis with gelatin. Never would have though of that. Saves power and reduces wear and tear on the equipment too.

Yeah Wynn fucked over Ontario good. None of it even made any sense from a technical point of view as the wind and solar create grid instability.
and Talking about things running efficiently at steady state....Wynn had nuclear power plants de-rating every time the wind blew just so that she could say "see how much power the windmills make" The cycle cost on those turbines is in the 100's of millions. I'd like to see what the true cost of renewable is if those were added. People maybe don't even know that our tax dollars were paid to a private company to NOT make power, a bonus paid on top for the equipment damage incurred, and THEN we paid the wind producers 36cents kwh for power instead of just the 4.5cents

personally, l had just put in my own ground source heat pump as the cheapest heating option available...... 2 years later, the price doubled. Hindsight says I should have went with the wood boiler.

Anyone who lives in Ontario who liked Wynn has to be more brain dead than a Trudeua fan.. Wynn was an absolute souless peice of shit. I swear part of the reason she got away with her bullshit was the fact that she was a woman

 

[Sorbate]

Anyone who lives in Ontario who liked Wynn has to be more brain dead than a Trudeua fan.. Wynn was an absolute souless peice of shit. I swear part of the reason she got away with her bullshit was the fact that she was a woman

She only won the second term because Hudac 2 weeks before (I think 2 weeks) stated he was going to get rid of 100,000 government workers.
That killed him, I remember seeing it on the news and thinking, did you want to lose.

Mind you at the end, Wynn and her party didn’t get enough votes for party status, lol.
Her head blew up when she won the second term, she really thought people voted for her because they loved her and what she was doing. And she was ignorant, “I know what Ontarians want”, hum no you don’t.
“ sorry, not sorry” was her other quote when asked about the high power rates.

 

[Heraclitus]

Lol, wood boiler. Could have likely been cheaper with a forced air wood stove.
Yeah, I’m glad I didn’t put a heat pump on my pool. Went with a 400,000 btu gas heater instead.
Now if I had ac in my house, I could have used that to heat the pool, but usually when you need ac, the pool is warm enough. So no real savings.
I was going to use the heat the pool pump motor produced but it was too much money for a water cooled motor, than what I would get in heat. I guess the motor may last longer, but for $50 I can change burned out bearings every 4 years.

I had no idea about derating the plants. But I knew the gave a ton of money to the companies to build the windmills and overpaid them for the power.
I watched a show on the economics of a windmill, and it was pretty much figured out, that even if they used all the numbers the green environmentalists use, it would still be cheaper to pay the damage climate change would bring, that the cost of the windmills, and he didn’t include the cost to the wildlife and the blades not being recyclable.

Oh and the gelatin idea wasn’t mine. A guy came in to sell me stuff to increase my power efficiency, like dc motors (15 year pay back because they are too small) and one of his ideas was to sell me a “special” meat like substitute for like $300, lol. So in my first experiment, I used actual chunks of beef and threw them out before they went bad. It worked so then I bought some gelatin that is more like bullistic gel, but more air pockets and then used that instead.

I’m not smart enough to figure out these things on my own, but I’m good at listening and bright enough to know if it may be a good idea or scam, lol.

Derating any thermal plant is really hard on the equipment, but it's extra stupid on nuclear because there are not any savings.
In coal or oil you at least save fuel cost. On nuclear reactors they divert the steam away from the turbines and condense it with lake water. 400MW of extra heat gets sent to the lake so that 400MW of wind power can go on the grid. This can only make sense to a politician with no concept of reality.

knowing how not to get scammed in a subject area you don't know, is about as smart as it gets. innit? People today are so specialized I think most have lost all critical reasoning skills and just do whatever some authority tells them.

 

[Heraclitus]

She only won the second term because Hudac 2 weeks before (I think 2 weeks) stated he was going to get rid of 100,000 government workers.
That killed him, I remember seeing it on the news and thinking, did you want to lose.

Mind you at the end, Wynn and her party didn’t get enough votes for party status, lol.
Her head blew up when she won the second term, she really thought people voted for her because they loved her and what she was doing. And she was ignorant, “I know what Ontarians want”, hum no you don’t.
“ sorry, not sorry” was her other quote when asked about the high power rates.

Who woulda thought anyone could be worse than McGuinty

 

[Sorbate]

Derating any thermal plant is really hard on the equipment, but it's extra stupid on nuclear because there are not any savings.
In coal or oil you at least save fuel cost. On nuclear reactors they divert the steam away from the turbines and condense it with lake water. 400MW of extra heat gets sent to the lake so that 400MW of wind power can go on the grid. This can only make sense to a politician with no concept of reality.

knowing how not to get scammed in a subject area you don't know, is about as smart as it gets. innit? People today are so specialized I think most have lost all critical reasoning skills and just do whatever some authority tells them.

I find, and it even happens to me, if you stroke their ego, they will talk to look smart. Then you can gleen onformation.

What a waste of heated water, plus isn’t that bad for the environment heating the lake? You know the green energy was all about saving the planet.

 

[animal-inside]

She only won the second term because Hudac 2 weeks before (I think 2 weeks) stated he was going to get rid of 100,000 government workers.
That killed him, I remember seeing it on the news and thinking, did you want to lose.

Mind you at the end, Wynn and her party didn’t get enough votes for party status, lol.
Her head blew up when she won the second term, she really thought people voted for her because they loved her and what she was doing. And she was ignorant, “I know what Ontarians want”, hum no you don’t.
“ sorry, not sorry” was her other quote when asked about the high power rates.

My mother loved Wynn. Then I’d ask her stuff like “how do you like your 1500$ a month utility bill?”.. she would just make this distorted awkward shameful face in response to my questions


My mother is pure liberal though.

 

[Sorbate]

My mother loved Wynn. Then I’d ask her stuff like “how do you like your 1500$ a month utility bill?”.. she would just make this distorted awkward shameful face in response to my questions


My mother is pure liberal though.

Yeah I don’t get the justification.
I could understand if let’s say your mothers said, our power bill is high, but unemployment is at its lowest, inflation is under control so pretty much Whynn made life better for society.
But you couldn’t say that about her, she cut healthcare until promising usnstainable amounts just before her last election. Was caught benefiting friends at the expense of tax payers and so on.
I don’t get it. I don’t just blindly vote for a party “just because”.

 

[Heraclitus]

IMO, her privatizing Hydro One to pay for toronto public transit,
when Toronto isn't even serviced by Hydro One, and people in the rest of the province don't use toronto public transit...

well, that tells me everything about where her priorities lay.
Toronto has too much vote power that it can sell everyone elses services away to pay for their own. That's not democracy, that's mob rule.

A buddy of mine lives on the same lake she has a cottage.
When he sees her out paddling, he has a sudden urge to cruise the lake in his wake boat.
Take pleasure in the little things whenever you can.

 

[Sorbate]

IMO, her privatizing Hydro One to pay for toronto public transit,
when Toronto isn't even serviced by Hydro One, and people in the rest of the province don't use toronto public transit...

well, that tells me everything about where her priorities lay.
Toronto has too much vote power that it can sell everyone elses services away to pay for their own. That's not democracy, that's mob rule.

A buddy of mine lives on the same lake she has a cottage.
When he sees her out paddling, he has a sudden urge to cruise the lake in his wake boat.
Take pleasure in the little things whenever you can.

That is great. She deserves it.
I thought she sold hydro one so we couldn’t look into what they did because now it was privatized.