Insulin without gh..bad idea?

Synyster

Active member
Trusted Member
Hi gents....

I'm considering using insulin for the 1st time.

I have a bottle of humalog already....and I'm confident in my knowledge on the subject with regards to dosing/timing/food intake etc.

But I'm curious if using insulin WITHOUT hgh is a recipe for getting fat?

Obviously using hgh would make this optimal but I honestly dont have a source for any of the generics that i have confidence in (opti in particular). Nor do I have the funds for pharma unless it was a totally life changing compound.

Id be starting at 5iu post workout to be safe. Which is likely quite low considering the amount of carbs I take in pre/intra/post (100/80-100/80-120). And I of course have a BG monitor.

Goal is to get enough confidence in the process and in the dosing that I could use it pre and post workout.

But I'm curious if insulin without using hgh is a recipe for fat gain? I'm currently recomping very successfully and its only getting better each week. But I feel I can do better.

My diet seems quite dialed in currently.

Any opinions eouod be appreciated.

Thanks
 

Harley00

The Rebel
Trusted Member
I dont know enough about gh and insulin to make a big enough argument, but our bodys typically have enough insulin already which a blood test would show.
making it more usable maybe would be the better option , like metformin possibly.

My take , but im welcomed to be told im a fucking idiot.
 

Sorbate

Trusted Member
Trusted Member
Don’t. Train for a while first and get the most out of the gear, then add it in later when you stall out.
Personally no amounts of gains are worth me chancing going hypo and maybe dying, so I only used it for a bit, thought wtf am I doing then stopped.
That was before my colon surgery and such though.
 

ironwill

Meat Eater and potato peeler
Trusted Member
I did use slin on its own as i was eating a loootttt of carbs in a bulking phase. It did help. You run a fine line on getting chubby though. I did it for exact reason as Harley00 mentioned, just nutrition utilization. As i use berberin for currently.
 

IronRobi

Well-known member
Trusted Member
I'm confident in my knowledge on the subject with regards to dosing/timing/food intake etc.

But I'm curious if using insulin WITHOUT hgh is a recipe for getting fat?
These 2 statements contradict each other. If you were truly confident in your dosing/timing/food intake then you'd know the answer to your question as well.

I don't give insulin advice anymore because of the dangers behind it, so I will answer your question very simply and say yes it can be done both safely and without getting fat. But to do so you need to really know your dosing/timing/food intake but also how your body reacts to all of the above.

So my recommendation here will be take what you think you know, then take some more time studying until you really do know it.
 

3ml

Moderator
Trusted Member
These 2 statements contradict each other. If you were truly confident in your dosing/timing/food intake then you'd know the answer to your question as well.

I don't give insulin advice anymore because of the dangers behind it, so I will answer your question very simply and say yes it can be done both safely and without getting fat. But to do so you need to really know your dosing/timing/food intake but also how your body reacts to all of the above.

So my recommendation here will be take what you think you know, then take some more time studying until you really do know it.
I second what Mr. Iron Robi says.

It can be done safely.
Timing with or without GH is basically the same.
Your diet will have to be very tight though. Gh will afford you a bit of leeway in regards to getting fat. Insulin by itself is tricky but doable.

You have a couple options. Try doing things yourself. Monitor and record what happens. Start slow and low and always keep sugar close by. Also let someone know around you that you are using it. This is a very important thing. One time it's actually good to have a gf or wife is when you run slin. Tell them what can happen, what the symptoms are like and what to do WHEN IN IT HAPPENS. Notice I said WHEN. Everyone I know including myself has come close to going hypo.

The other option, get a coach who knows how to do this. You will grow your knowledge on the subject much faster.
 

Jestopherson

Well-known member
Trusted Member
I believe you can get a diabetic bracelet from a pharmacy if you want to be extra safe.

I obviously won't be offering any insulin advice however a friend keeps high sugar Gatorade powder in his gym bag which he keeps next to him if he takes slin pre-workout
 

IronRobi

Well-known member
Trusted Member
You have a couple options. Try doing things yourself. Monitor and record what happens. Start slow and low and always keep sugar close by. Also let someone know around you that you are using it. This is a very important thing. One time it's actually good to have a gf or wife is when you run slin. Tell them what can happen, what the symptoms are like and what to do WHEN IN IT HAPPENS. Notice I said WHEN. Everyone I know including myself has come close to going hypo.

The other option, get a coach who knows how to do this. You will grow your knowledge on the subject much faster.
Great advice right here! You can add me to the list of those who have been at the point of going hypo. It's not fun.

One thing I will add that's not often talked about when discussing insulin is how your level of exertion affects things. You can dial in everything perfectly with weeks of fine tuning and still end up going hypo because you pushed harder than normal on your last set. If you know a diabetic, talk to them. They may not know much about how insulin relates to bodybuilding, but you can learn a ton from them still.
 

ironwill

Meat Eater and potato peeler
Trusted Member
Great advice right here! You can add me to the list of those who have been at the point of going hypo. It's not fun.

One thing I will add that's not often talked about when discussing insulin is how your level of exertion affects things. You can dial in everything perfectly with weeks of fine tuning and still end up going hypo because you pushed harder than normal on your last set. If you know a diabetic, talk to them. They may not know much about how insulin relates to bodybuilding, but you can learn a ton from them still.
Yup, good points @IronRobi and @3ml.

There is also a thing that happens while working out. You actually release glycogen into the blood.

As we all know it is stored in muscle and liver. SOOO, one can take it preworkout and not need as much sugars exogenously sourced with a dose of Slin, BUT first we use muscle glycogen, and then liver. Muscle glycogen is released fairly quick, liver is less amount and slower release. all of it being utilized in about an hours time depending on intensity etc.
So you will release glucose to your blood and not require as much sugar intake.

Therefore it can be very . very tricky to know when that wall you WILL HIT is coming. This is dangerland and when you need the extra sugars very close to you. Glucose tabs are a very nice to have as it hits your system quicker and more readily.

Post workout is another story ..BUT opposite as your muscles will re uptake the sugars you take in and convert to glycogen and use to refill the muscle stores and liver stores, and you need extra glucose at this time. BUT. once the door shuts on storage...You end up with extra, then it can become stored and become fat.

Tricky shit and this is not dosing advice, nor anything of the sort as i wont advise on the subject.

Just a bit more knowledge to throw out there for the author to think about.
 

3ml

Moderator
Trusted Member
Yup, good points @IronRobi and @3ml.

There is also a thing that happens while working out. You actually release glycogen into the blood.

As we all know it is stored in muscle and liver. SOOO, one can take it preworkout and not need as much sugars exogenously sourced with a dose of Slin, BUT first we use muscle glycogen, and then liver. Muscle glycogen is released fairly quick, liver is less amount and slower release. all of it being utilized in about an hours time depending on intensity etc.
So you will release glucose to your blood and not require as much sugar intake.

Therefore it can be very . very tricky to know when that wall you WILL HIT is coming. This is dangerland and when you need the extra sugars very close to you. Glucose tabs are a very nice to have as it hits your system quicker and more readily.

Post workout is another story ..BUT opposite as your muscles will re uptake the sugars you take in and convert to glycogen and use to refill the muscle stores and liver stores, and you need extra glucose at this time. BUT. once the door shuts on storage...You end up with extra, then it can become stored and become fat.

Tricky shit and this is not dosing advice, nor anything of the sort as i wont advise on the subject.

Just a bit more knowledge to throw out there for the author to think about.
Very well explained
 

Synyster

Active member
Trusted Member
I appreciate the advice gents.

Thankful for so many knowledgeable dudes here. Young kids nowadays dont know how lucky they are to have resources like this forum for legit answers.
 

MtlStrgth

Member
Trusted Member
From my experience, to get significant results from slin you must use supraphysiological dose everyday of fast acting slin like humalog or humulin r... If you only use 5-10iu pre workout, you basically get similar effect as when your pancreas produce its own slin after eating a big bowl of rice, you gain nothing more than that. Using supraphysiological slin dose during the day makes you much more hungry and enable you to eat 4-5k clean cals easily as the slin will actually make you crave that plain rice and chicken... Now the thing is even if you're eating very clean , slin will shuttle a lot of these cals into your fat store. UNLESS you are on high dose of aas and hgh, both increasing protein synthesis and lipolysis, so that a larger portion of the cals you ingest goes into building muscle and the hgh in your system allow you to lose fat even if you also have slin in your blood. Basically, slin completely inhibit lipolysis, so unless you take something else to counter that, you will get fat if using slin in dosage necessary to get results.
I'll repeat what I said in a previous post, slin is just not worth it unless you want to be a 300lbs pro bber. Just increase aas dose if you want more results, take regular dose of hgh+t3 with it, be happy and lean, without worrying about going hypo all the time.
I know you're still probably going to try it... When you start feeling like shit, weak, light headed, going hypo during your workout even tho you've just had 150g+ of carbs in the last hour, think of this post lol.
 
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IronRobi

Well-known member
Trusted Member
@MtlStrgth I would recommend editing out that recommended dose before someone reads it, tries it and dies from it. I'd leave it at just supraphysiological dose....

I would never recommend that much slin to anybody unless it were a long lasting slin like lantus, in which case that dose is actually fairly common.
 

3ml

Moderator
Trusted Member
@MtlStrgth I would recommend editing out that recommended dose before someone reads it, tries it and dies from it. I'd leave it at just supraphysiological dose....

I would never recommend that much slin to anybody unless it were a long lasting slin like lantus, in which case that dose is actually fairly common.
I would love to debate your dosing, but this isn't the place for it. I agree all insulin dose numbers should be kept off the boards.

I fumble fucked with insulin many times and couldn't get it right. Until I got a coach who knew it well. Then it was quite easy to manage, yet still dangerous. You cannot get complacent with that shit.
 
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