GROWTH HORMONE

[GearDog]

It’s tempting; I’ve also told myself that I don’t wanna fuck with slin, although I’ve heard running the longer acting stuff is fairly simple

This couldnt be further from the truth. You have to be an experienced slin user to use the longer acting stuff. If you are really curious about trying insulin, start with humalog. Humalog should be everyones starter of choice. Lantus without a perfect diet and consistent BG monitoring throughout the day, and knowledge of how it will effect you, will most likely just make you fat.

 

[3ml]

This couldnt be further from the truth. You have to be an experienced slin user to use the longer acting stuff. If you are really curious about trying insulin, start with humalog. Humalog should be everyones starter of choice. Lantus without a perfect diet and consistent BG monitoring throughout the day, and knowledge of how it will effect you, will most likely just make you fat.

Agreed
R has come close to fucking me a col times.
Log is far easier to manage

 

[OTFJOEY]

This couldnt be further from the truth. You have to be an experienced slin user to use the longer acting stuff. If you are really curious about trying insulin, start with humalog. Humalog should be everyones starter of choice. Lantus without a perfect diet and consistent BG monitoring throughout the day, and knowledge of how it will effect you, will most likely just make you fat.

Thanks for this, yea I haven’t the slightest I remember reading bits and pieces about it here and there, but never have I delved into it

 

[omenra]

To sum it up GH is like the nice rims on the car. Much more cost effective with peptides, steroids and insulin. GH works wonders at burning fat during fasted cardio. It provides a intramuscular more specifically when you are lean. Pharma all the way! If you decide to the plunge. You can also you use hgh-176 or superdrol! Keep in mind for the actual hyperplasia to occur from GH you need to be taking over eight IU's a day. People will call me on this all day. I have worked with many IFBB pro's all the way to amateurs. Anecdotal evidence, MSC in biochemistry molecular biology does not lie

 

[OTFJOEY]

To sum it up GH is like the nice rims on the car. Much more cost effective with peptides, steroids and insulin. GH works wonders at burning fat during fasted cardio. It provides a intramuscular more specifically when you are lean. Pharma all the way! If you decide to the plunge. You can also you use hgh-157 or superdrol! Keep in mind for the actual hyperplasia to occur from GH you need to be taking over eight IU's a day. People will call me on this all day. I have worked with many IFBB pro's all the way to amateurs. Anecdotal evidence, MSC in biochemistry molecular biology does not lie

I disagree with this as a blanket statement for all; I feel like 3-4 iu’s of pharma GH over the course of 6-9 months can do this

 

[BCbabyB]

I disagree with this as a blanket statement for all; I feel like 3-4 iu’s of pharma GH over the course of 6-9 months can do this

My understanding is that hyperplasia only occurs at a certain level of IGF-1 saturation, I do not know numbers. It is also my understanding that the IGF-1 response from HGH alone without insulin or exogenous IGF-1 supplementation has significant diminishing returns after 3-4 IUs.

In this study they went up to 20IU of pharma per day and only got up to 700-800 IGF-1 https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10580755/

 

[OTFJOEY]

My understanding is that hyperplasia only occurs at a certain level of IGF-1 saturation, I do not know numbers. It is also my understanding that the IGF-1 response from HGH alone without insulin or exogenous IGF-1 supplementation has significant diminishing returns after 3-4 IUs.

In this study they went up to 20IU of pharma per day and only got up to 700-800 IGF-1 https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10580755/

That’s because there’s a ceiling effect on GH that stops at like 8 -9 iu’s not even much more IGF-1 than you’d get from 5 iu’s.

 

[Goldenrod]

Slow down.

You are obviously just learning about GH.
I am not a fan of omnitrope as far as pharma goes.

There isn't even a way to compare generics to pharma grade. Just do not work the same way for whatever reason.
My advice wait and learn more.

Also do not have too high of expectations out of it unless you are willing to run 4 units or higher with insulin.

wise words - HGH is great in low doses and you will heal a little faster, possibly get a little stronger, and there are some noticeable 'anti-aging' type effects but it is no magic elixir. I wouldn't waste my time with generics - I prefer Sero or Genos but each to their own. I won't run it any less than a year at a time because I use low doses.
I don't take more than 2 IU a day - tried 3 IU for a short period but didn't make much of a difference. If you know what your doing, like @3ml said, you can get muscle growth from it but you better have a good coach or do a lot of homework. Messing with some of the other compounds people take with HGH can be dangerous.
I'm a less is more guy but I have been lifting for years so it doesn't take much to add some muscle due to muscle memory. I found the HGH best when I was training with weights and doing some MMA - hard on the body and I recovered quicker but I don't think I added any muscle and I ran it for 2 years straight with TRT. I got in better condition, looked better but I didn't gain any weight but I also wasn't trying to. My diet was for maintenance as I didn't want to go over 215 at the time.

My last year run was with Sero and Genos with 100 mg test E and 100 mg of Primo - a very small cycle by comparison to most here but I hit 240 lbs. It took a couple years but I kept what I gained and now I am back to TRT alone.

I won't exceed 2 IU ever again as I don't want to touch insulin. I have never felt better than the triple combo mentioned above. it is expensive and the return if your looking for muscle growth isn't the same as many steroids. That being said, it depends on what your goals are. If your older like me and still like to push yourself hard, it is a nice addition to a cycle for the injury prevention and healing.

 

[entropy]

wise words - HGH is great in low doses and you will heal a little faster, possibly get a little stronger, and there are some noticeable 'anti-aging' type effects but it is no magic elixir. I wouldn't waste my time with generics - I prefer Sero or Genos but each to their own. I won't run it any less than a year at a time because I use low doses.
I don't take more than 2 IU a day - tried 3 IU for a short period but didn't make much of a difference. If you know what your doing, like @3ml said, you can get muscle growth from it but you better have a good coach or do a lot of homework. Messing with some of the other compounds people take with HGH can be dangerous.
I'm a less is more guy but I have been lifting for years so it doesn't take much to add some muscle due to muscle memory. I found the HGH best when I was training with weights and doing some MMA - hard on the body and I recovered quicker but I don't think I added any muscle and I ran it for 2 years straight with TRT. I got in better condition, looked better but I didn't gain any weight but I also wasn't trying to. My diet was for maintenance as I didn't want to go over 215 at the time.

My last year run was with Sero and Genos with 100 mg test E and 100 mg of Primo - a very small cycle by comparison to most here but I hit 240 lbs. It took a couple years but I kept what I gained and now I am back to TRT alone.

I won't exceed 2 IU ever again as I don't want to touch insulin. I have never felt better than the triple combo mentioned above. it is expensive and the return if your looking for muscle growth isn't the same as many steroids. That being said, it depends on what your goals are. If your older like me and still like to push yourself hard, it is a nice addition to a cycle for the injury prevention and healing.

Thank you for your informative post.
I’m interested in the injury prevention and healing aspect. In your experience, would you say the primo had a contributing effect to that along side the 2iu of HGH?

Hyperplasia? I can’t even start to hypertrophy these muscles

 

[OTFJOEY]

wise words - HGH is great in low doses and you will heal a little faster, possibly get a little stronger, and there are some noticeable 'anti-aging' type effects but it is no magic elixir. I wouldn't waste my time with generics - I prefer Sero or Genos but each to their own. I won't run it any less than a year at a time because I use low doses.
I don't take more than 2 IU a day - tried 3 IU for a short period but didn't make much of a difference. If you know what your doing, like @3ml said, you can get muscle growth from it but you better have a good coach or do a lot of homework. Messing with some of the other compounds people take with HGH can be dangerous.
I'm a less is more guy but I have been lifting for years so it doesn't take much to add some muscle due to muscle memory. I found the HGH best when I was training with weights and doing some MMA - hard on the body and I recovered quicker but I don't think I added any muscle and I ran it for 2 years straight with TRT. I got in better condition, looked better but I didn't gain any weight but I also wasn't trying to. My diet was for maintenance as I didn't want to go over 215 at the time.

My last year run was with Sero and Genos with 100 mg test E and 100 mg of Primo - a very small cycle by comparison to most here but I hit 240 lbs. It took a couple years but I kept what I gained and now I am back to TRT alone.

I won't exceed 2 IU ever again as I don't want to touch insulin. I have never felt better than the triple combo mentioned above. it is expensive and the return if your looking for muscle growth isn't the same as many steroids. That being said, it depends on what your goals are. If your older like me and still like to push yourself hard, it is a nice addition to a cycle for the injury prevention and healing.

Appreciate the response @Goldenrod ; I decided to get some Humatrope and I’m running 3 iu’s a day, I don’t plan on running it shorter than 6 months; most likely a year if I like what I see by month 6; I’m also just starting a pretty nice fast acting cycle to run alongside the GH; so far so good, I’m 5 days in and I definitely notice my tren and test suspension working

 

[ABMonkey]

Appreciate the response @Goldenrod ; I decided to get some Humatrope and I’m running 3 iu’s a day, I don’t plan on running it shorter than 6 months; most likely a year if I like what I see by month 6; I’m also just starting a pretty nice fast acting cycle to run alongside the GH; so far so good, I’m 5 days in and I definitely notice my tren and test suspension working

Good to monitor your BG when running GH. You can get the whole setup inc strips for like $100.

When running GH I pull mine at least once a week.

 

[Goldenrod]

Thank you for your informative post.
I’m interested in the injury prevention and healing aspect. In your experience, would you say the primo had a contributing effect to that along side the 2iu of HGH?

Hyperplasia? I can’t even start to hypertrophy these muscles

I have learned to manipulate my hormones with little PED's - Test (TRT) so I am in the normal high range for test for my age (total test), and the Primo over an extended period vastly increases my free test much higher than the normal parameters. The small amount of Primo I take isn't going to make a huge difference in size in the short term but it definitely did in the long term - 6 months plus with my TRT.
I find almost any PED helpful for healing and I like Primo for its side effect profile and impact on my free test.
The combo of the three have kept me mostly injury free and able to train hard and I'm not young. I doubt I gained much muscle mass of 2 IU of HGH a day but I am confident in saying it helped heal previous injuries and prevent new ones.
To what degree the three worked better than another, I don't know. I do know I have never felt better on 100 mg of test enanthate, 100-150 mg of Primo, and 2 IU of HGH. Only negative on the HGH is the short spike in BP and it seems to interfere with sleep.
Its a trade off through. If I want to act like I'm 20 when I'm in my 40's - I want my hormones to be what they were in their 20's.

If I was younger I might run higher doses but health is a priority for me and if I can hit 240 lbs without really eating to bulk - 3,000 calories of quality food in 6 meals a day I consider it progress. I cut it down by a few 100 calories and adjust my macros and can easily cut back to 220-225.

If your interested in healing and preventing injuries, suggest you do some reading on BPC157 and TB500 (peptides) as well. Both have helped some of my past injuries and others not so much. BPC is a miracle for some tendon/ligament injuries.

I ran a log here prior fighting off injuries with low doses of PED's and had tremendous success. Once I got healed up, I was able to kick up the training a bit and before I knew it I was around 240. I was never 10% BF and won't lie about that fact but you could see my abs and I got much more vascular. Considering my age, I was happy with the outcome.

I will run it again soon but for now I am happy maintaining with food and TRT.

 

[OTFJOEY]

I have learned to manipulate my hormones with little PED's - Test (TRT) so I am in the normal high range for test for my age (total test), and the Primo over an extended period vastly increases my total test much higher than the normal parameters. The small amount of Primo I take isn't going to make a huge difference in size in the short term but it definitely did in the long term - 6 months plus with my TRT.
I find almost any PED helpful for healing and I like Primo for its side effect profile and impact on my free test.
The combo of the three have kept me mostly injury free and able to train hard and I'm not young. I doubt I gained much muscle mass of 2 IU of HGH a day but I am confident in saying it helped heal previous injuries and prevent new ones.
To what degree the three worked better than another, I don't know. I do know I have never felt better on 100 mg of test enanthate, 100-150 mg of Primo, and 2 IU of HGH. Only negative on the HGH is the short spike in BP and it seems to interfere with sleep.
Its a trade off through. If I want to act like I'm 20 when I'm in my 40's - I want my hormones to be what they were in their 20's.

If I was younger I might run higher doses but health is a priority for me and if I can hit 240 lbs without really eating to bulk - 3,000 calories of quality food in 6 meals a day I consider it progress. I cut it down by a few 100 calories and adjust my macros and can easily cut back to 220-225.

If your interested in healing and preventing injuries, suggest you do some reading on BPC157 and TB500 (peptides) as well. Both have helped some of my past injuries and others not so much. BPC is a miracle for some tendon/ligament injuries.

I ran a log here prior fighting off injuries with low doses of PED's and had tremendous success. Once I got healed up, I was able to kick up the training a bit and before I knew it I was around 240. I was never 10% BF and won't lie about that fact but you could see my abs and I got much more vascular. Considering my age, I was happy with the outcome.

I will run it again soon but for now I am happy maintaining with food and TRT.

@Goldenrod ; I have a question for you; currently I’m running my test at 350/ wk, (lower than my mast and my tren) I do a 0.33 mL shot of test suspension per day which equals about 50 mgs . Now going into the latter stages of my cycle; do you think I will have to add a base of 100/ Delatestryl enth every Monday to keep it more stable you think? Or will the shot of suspension a day suffice? Mind you I’m running 75 tren ace a day and 50 masteron per day as well. I have some var I’d like to throw in down the road after I shape out a bit better and get my BF% down; I started taking a BP log and I think you might be on to something @ABMonkey with the BG testing I will look into buying a set up. Thanks

EDIT: my test susp and mast prop are at equal doses, not mast higher

 

[entropy]

@Goldenrod
Thanks bro. You always put in enough detail, I appreciate it.

 

[Goldenrod]

@Goldenrod
Thanks bro. You always put in enough detail, I appreciate it.

welcome, I reread what I wrote and see I wrote I said Primo increased my total test, I meant free test. I just changed it.

 

[Goldenrod]

@Goldenrod ; I have a question for you; currently I’m running my test at 350/ wk, (lower than my mast and my tren) I do a 0.33 mL shot of test suspension per day which equals about 50 mgs . Now going into the latter stages of my cycle; do you think I will have to add a base of 100/ Delatestryl enth every Monday to keep it more stable you think? Or will the shot of suspension a day suffice? Mind you I’m running 75 tren ace a day and 50 masteron per day as well. I have some var I’d like to throw in down the road after I shape out a bit better and get my BF% down; I started taking a BP log and I think you might be on to something @ABMonkey with the BG testing I will look into buying a set up. Thanks

EDIT: my test susp and mast prop are at equal doses, not mast higher

There is a BP log here for everyone now: https://www.canadianbrawn.com/threads/whats-your-blood-pressure-today.2956/page-34#post-160211

I have never used test suspension but I don't know why you would have to change the ester at the end of your cycle. The ester should only determine when you start your PCT compounds (I don't include HCG in that comment as I would be starting HCG immediately and waiting a few weeks for the compounds to clear before starting clomid or nolvadex or both. A longer ester and you wait longer before jumping on a SERM. I have read so many different PCT programs, you will have to determine which one is best for you. @ABMonkey has offered some insight in the past and considering I am on TRT, I don't PCT anymore.

I don't know how long you have run your cycle for but if I was running 350 mg of test, 525 mg of tren, and 350 mg of mast a week, I wouldn't be adding in an oral before I had my blood results to see where your lipids, liver, and kidney function stand. I would save it for another cycle.

I'm not sure if I answered you question but no I wouldn't add in another compound and just finish what your doing and PCT. Get your health checked out and if all is well, use your oxandrolone for another cycle.

 

[Synyster]

In my opinion....id go pharma or nadda.
Secondly id suggest either committing to 1 year (or more) at 2-3iu/day or if you want 6 months id bump it to 4-6iu/day in 4 shots.

As stated here....the biggest thing you'll notice is fat loss in my opinion. If you're after muscle gain I'd add insulin also 100%. But then ur in a whole new world of possible complications.
Think of it like marrying the nice girl next door (juice + low dose hgh) versus marrying the smoking hot big fake fitted blonde (juice + hgh + insulin). From the outside if all goes well it sure looks good to have the blonde....but the amount of headaches and constant upkeep makes it almost not worth it. For every one marriage that works out well with the big fake fitted blonde, there are 10 that tried and went down in flames.
Many of the guys who go that route later wish they stayed with the girl next door and had a nice quiet life with no issues and less chlamydia.

 

[OTFJOEY]

In my opinion....id go pharma or nadda.
Secondly id suggest either committing to 1 year (or more) at 2-3iu/day or if you want 6 months id bump it to 4-6iu/day in 4 shots.

As stated here....the biggest thing you'll notice is fat loss in my opinion. If you're after muscle gain I'd add insulin also 100%. But then ur in a whole new world of possible complications.
Think of it like marrying the nice girl next door (juice + low dose hgh) versus marrying the smoking hot big fake fitted blonde (juice + hgh + insulin). From the outside if all goes well it sure looks good to have the blonde....but the amount of headaches and constant upkeep makes it almost not worth it. For every one marriage that works out well with the big fake fitted blonde, there are 10 that tried and went down in flames.
Many of the guys who go that route later wish they stayed with the girl next door and had a nice quiet life with no issues and less chlamydia.

I fuckin love this metaphor. I think I’ll opt for the low dose GH for longer periods lol. I was going to start a new thread asking about the synergy between GH and anabolics; will my cycle be much more pronounced as I get further into the GH; also, I was going to get like 2-3 Genos just to compare what it’s like vs humatrope. I hear they have to be used in a certain time once you constitute it, right? I don’t think I wanna fuck with slin; at least not right now. I’m optimistic about longevity and trying to stay as healthy as possible; but hey; for every action there is a reaction, right? I don’t think you come out unscathed either way

 

[OTFJOEY]

So I’ve been on humatrope 3 iu’s per day before bed. Just about on my 5th week. Nothing too noticeable yet maybe tightened midsection, a couple extra pounds of water. But not feeling anything “negative” per say. Just waiting to notice the effects myself.

 

[OTFJOEY]

I’ve had some good experience with these guys so far. Made my 4th order no issues