Extreme fascia stretching for muscle growth

ajfromab

ISYMFS
Trusted Member
Read a lot of articles on this lately and a lot of really interesting information out there.
I know a lot of the old guys the classic bodybuilders they would do a lot of heavy stretching.
A lot of research over the past few years has shown how stretching the fascia can lead to huge gains in muscle size.
A quick run through here
Fascia:

Fascia is a thin casing of connective tissue that surrounds and holds every organ, blood vessel, bone, nerve fiber and muscle in place. The tissue does more than provide internal structure; fascia has nerves that make it almost as sensitive as skin.

There are three types of fascia: superficial, deep and visceral

Superficial Fascia is found just beneath the skin in the sub cutis of most regions of the body

Deep Fascia which surrounds the muscles, bones, nerves, and blood vessels.

Visceral Fascia suspends organs in their cavities

Deep Fascia is the one we will be concentrating on. Muscle fascia or myofascia, is a type of deep fascia that can determine the flexibility or muscle growth of an individual.

How it works in simple simple terms because I like to keep things simple:
So your fascia surrounds your muscle fibres. I’m order for your muscle fibres to grow , the fascia needs to stretch .
So how do we stretch the fascia.
Muscle pumps , blood getting into the muscle ,
And stretching .

So how do we apply this in our workouts.

Stretch between each set , this is not standing there stretching for minutes on end it can be as simple as ten - fifteen second holds.

And at the end of training your muscle group you do an extreme stretch.
What do I mean by this .
Chest is an easy example .
Lie on the bench like you are doing a fly with a couple dumbbells. Instead of doing a rep though allow the weight to pull the muscle down on the chest amd even use your arms to stretch this further.
Hold this for one minute , amd do it extreme amd yes it will hurt , and yes it will help with muscle growth big time.

Here’s some links if you wanna read up more



And for the guys who like to read studies done by the professionals



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Dante Trudel was a huge proponent of extreme stretching to finish a muscle group off. It's one of the key principles of DC Training. For great examples of this for various muscle groups, just check out any of the DC Training guides.
 
I was a DC trained guy and then his sponsored athlete for Canada for 9 years... DC training is very much about this topic...
It did assist me in gaining strength through mobility, and it may have assisted in muscle growth, MAYBE...One word of caution...Take this shit slow, very, very slow...Microtears in the fascia and muscle groups have been shown to contribute to muscle tears...I dont do the extreme stretching anymore, maybe i may start once again...
Proceed with caution...
 
I was a DC trained guy and then his sponsored athlete for Canada for 9 years... DC training is very much about this topic...
It did assist me in gaining strength through mobility, and it may have assisted in muscle growth, MAYBE...One word of caution...Take this shit slow, very, very slow...Microtears in the fascia and muscle groups have been shown to contribute to muscle tears...I dont do the extreme stretching anymore, maybe i may start once again...
Proceed with caution...

That was actually something I never considered thanks for bringing that up


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Jay cutler is big on stretching during and between sets as well. I've always done it. But it's one of those things that likely contributes slowly, really hard to know if it's done anything.

I do a lot of FST-7 style training - not the whole workout, but at least one exercise. Feels like muscles have gotten rounder and more full. But who knows?

I've also heard people talk about actually looking at Fascia in cadavers and saying it's super strong - the idea that you could stretch it being silly. No idea how true that is though.
 
I was a DC trained guy and then his sponsored athlete for Canada for 9 years... DC training is very much about this topic...
It did assist me in gaining strength through mobility, and it may have assisted in muscle growth, MAYBE...One word of caution...Take this shit slow, very, very slow...Microtears in the fascia and muscle groups have been shown to contribute to muscle tears...I dont do the extreme stretching anymore, maybe i may start once again...
Proceed with caution...
I agree, proceed with caution! when I followed the program 5-6 years ago I felt something wrong in my chest doing the stretching, not a tear but similar and can still feel it sometimes if I bench heavy or stretch harder.
 
I’ll ask my massage therapist about this next month. I know she took the course on this and was going to start doing fascia stretching to customers. But Im not sure if it was stretching the fascia or releasing it from the muscle.
I can’t remember but I believe she said you Couldn’t stretch it, but It will grow.
 
very short on time...

Anecdotal, when I was younger (the 80's) I had an insanely intense deep massage session, lasted about an hour and a half, crazy amounts of what i think we would call fascia planing today, top to bottom, I sweated heavily for about 4 hours after it was done.
It fucking blew me up literally over night. As far as stuff that could be measured the next morning my calves were a half inch bigger and my arms gained just over an inch 17.xx to 18.xx.
I loved it but could hardly move, this dude had made big promises and he backed it up. I assumed this was from better blood flow and inflammation and it would fade away in a day or two.
I was wrong, it never went away, never got smaller than that until I got married and quit training for a few years.

So I don't know exactly what to believe on this one, IOW exactly what happened or does happen, but that's my experience.
 
very short on time...

Anecdotal, when I was younger (the 80's) I had an insanely intense deep massage session, lasted about an hour and a half, crazy amounts of what i think we would call fascia planing today, top to bottom, I sweated heavily for about 4 hours after it was done.
It fucking blew me up literally over night. As far as stuff that could be measured the next morning my calves were a half inch bigger and my arms gained just over an inch 17.xx to 18.xx.
I loved it but could hardly move, this dude had made big promises and he backed it up. I assumed this was from better blood flow and inflammation and it would fade away in a day or two.
I was wrong, it never went away, never got smaller than that until I got married and quit training for a few years.

So I don't know exactly what to believe on this one, IOW exactly what happened or does happen, but that's my experience.
Lol - you just got swollen from damage. I don't think that was good for you or improved your future gains.
 
Lol - you just got swollen from damage. I don't think that was good for you or improved your future gains.
I'm not sure how to take your comment.

I could say "I disagree, I think it was very good for me. I was very tight previous to the treatment and much more flexible after. Not only did it not go away but I gained a fair bit more size and strength in the following six months despite thinking I had plateaued "
I actually went back two more times over the next year. I'm not sure about the fascia itself because that is some seriously tough stuff which as @ironwill , you and others have mentioned might not be too stretchable.
What I do think is that it broke down a lot of adhesions whether they were in the muscle or fascia.

On the other hand regarding "damage" - in effect that's how all muscle growth from progressive resistance occours is it not?
So...yes to getting swollen from damage? Bring it on... Laying still for 90 minutes to put a permanent inch on your arms and set all new PR's within six months? Bring it on...
And I'll repeat, this is just my anecdotal experience, I'm not trying to sell this idea to anyone. I will say that I would probably still be seeing this guy to this day but he disappeared one day. I still go for deep tissue work when I can afford too but nothing has come close to these treatments.

"Damage" along with recovery has always been the target of my training, is there another path?
 
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I'm not sure how to take your comment.

I could say "I disagree, I think it was very good for me. I was very tight previous to the treatment and much more flexible after. Not only did it not go away but I gained a fair bit more size and strength in the following six months despite thinking I had plateaued "
I actually went back two more times over the next year. I'm not sure about the fascia itself because that is some seriously tough stuff which as @ironwill , you and others have mentioned might not be too stretchable.
What I do think is that it broke down a lot of adhesions whether they were in the muscle or fascia.

On the other hand regarding "damage" - in effect that's how all muscle growth from progressive resistance occours is it not?
So...yes to getting swollen from damage? Bring it on... Laying still for 90 minutes to put a permanent inch on your arms and set all new PR's within six months? Bring it on...
And I'll repeat, this is just my anecdotal experience, I'm not trying to sell this idea to anyone. I will say that I would probably still be seeing this guy to this day but he disappeared one day. I still go for deep tissue work when I can afford too but nothing has come close to these treatments.

"Damage" along with recovery has always been the target of my training, is there another path?

Who was this guy who did the treatment and what was it called I’m kind of interested to tell you the truth I want more information


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Who was this guy who did the treatment and what was it called I’m kind of interested to tell you the truth I want more information


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I would have put it in the second post but as I said this was more than 30 years ago, he was an older gentlemen and he has probably passed on plus I can't remember. So sorry I don't have any useful current info. I wonder if specific google terms might help you find a practitioner, there are tons that do some form of this now but I wouldn't know how to weed through them. Maybe "myofascial release" or "graston" ? I just go to a local sport RMT and get "deep tissue massage once in a while these days, feels like the best bang for my buck at this point but you and I are in very different places in our training carrier right now.

Semi-Off-Topic (Est. Read Time 2min 22secs, 475 words):

I did find the whole scenario interesting, I really trusted the guys who recommended him though, it was some of the most serious guys in the area including some record holding powerlifters and a recent Mr Canada, provincial champs etc. I was never at that level but I was around those guys a lot, this therapist was kind of a secret that was kept within a small group.

I'm not trying to make it sound all mystical and magical or anything btw, I just realized it might start to sound like that... lolz

Anyhoo, I get the contact info and arrange an appointment. I realize right away that it's a home address. I get there and it's a 120 lb man, he's shiny balding with the horseshoe of hair thing going on, bout 120 lbs and he's got that great olive type skin that hides his age. Could be 55, which was old back in those days, or he could be 115, no clue.

Leads me through some stud walled hallways to a darkened bedroom with not much in it but a massage table. Or at least a table I was going to lie on. Naked Please.

Were you scared G?
At that time in my life I was extremely self confident in almost every way, that coupled with my belief at the time that there was a pretty good chance I may have been the outright toughest man on the planet at that time allowed me to stay chill.

So just to calm you fucking perverts down nothing funky happened.

If you have every had deep tissue massage or any of the myofascial release techniques that we are discussing here it was basically the same stuff. I don't think he used any instruments, I've had a bunch of these types of treatments over the years and if money was no object I'd go for a deep tissue massage of some sort every 10 days.

So it was those types of techniques but no-one has every done it with anywhere near that intensity since. It, nor similar treatments since, are not like that couples massage you had with the pretty music and warm rocks placed gently on your back.

It's an athletic event that needs a name that describes it as "try to stay completely relaxed so a man can try to emulsify every bit of soft skeletal tissue on your body in the most painful overload of all of your senses that you may ever experience" My tongue was spasming and would have sworn at the time that there was death metal playing at 11 the entire time.
 
I'm not sure how to take your comment.

I could say "I disagree, I think it was very good for me. I was very tight previous to the treatment and much more flexible after. Not only did it not go away but I gained a fair bit more size and strength in the following six months despite thinking I had plateaued "
I actually went back two more times over the next year. I'm not sure about the fascia itself because that is some seriously tough stuff which as @ironwill , you and others have mentioned might not be too stretchable.
What I do think is that it broke down a lot of adhesions whether they were in the muscle or fascia.

On the other hand regarding "damage" - in effect that's how all muscle growth from progressive resistance occours is it not?
So...yes to getting swollen from damage? Bring it on... Laying still for 90 minutes to put a permanent inch on your arms and set all new PR's within six months? Bring it on...
And I'll repeat, this is just my anecdotal experience, I'm not trying to sell this idea to anyone. I will say that I would probably still be seeing this guy to this day but he disappeared one day. I still go for deep tissue work when I can afford too but nothing has come close to these treatments.

"Damage" along with recovery has always been the target of my training, is there another path?
Yes. I agree lots to be said about art active release therapy. Lots swear by it for growth. Jay cutler credited that to his serious improvement in one that Olympia where he came out with an amazing back and better symmetry side to side as he said it was hindering him until he had the process done. I’d like to try it as well.
 
Yes. I agree lots to be said about art active release therapy. Lots swear by it for growth. Jay cutler credited that to his serious improvement in one that Olympia where he came out with an amazing back and better symmetry side to side as he said it was hindering him until he had the process done. I’d like to try it as well.

Is that the terminology “art active release therapy”?


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Also anecdotal but I've experienced decrease DOMS when doing RDL at the end of my posterior chain workout. I now always finish with RDLs. Used this for pecs with flies with good results aswell.
My warmup consists in a lot of dynamic stretching since it's associated with an increased performance outcome, contrary to static stretching.
 
I would have put it in the second post but as I said this was more than 30 years ago, he was an older gentlemen and he has probably passed on plus I can't remember. So sorry I don't have any useful current info. I wonder if specific google terms might help you find a practitioner, there are tons that do some form of this now but I wouldn't know how to weed through them. Maybe "myofascial release" or "graston" ? I just go to a local sport RMT and get "deep tissue massage once in a while these days, feels like the best bang for my buck at this point but you and I are in very different places in our training carrier right now.

Semi-Off-Topic (Est. Read Time 2min 22secs, 475 words):

I did find the whole scenario interesting, I really trusted the guys who recommended him though, it was some of the most serious guys in the area including some record holding powerlifters and a recent Mr Canada, provincial champs etc. I was never at that level but I was around those guys a lot, this therapist was kind of a secret that was kept within a small group.

I'm not trying to make it sound all mystical and magical or anything btw, I just realized it might start to sound like that... lolz

Anyhoo, I get the contact info and arrange an appointment. I realize right away that it's a home address. I get there and it's a 120 lb man, he's shiny balding with the horseshoe of hair thing going on, bout 120 lbs and he's got that great olive type skin that hides his age. Could be 55, which was old back in those days, or he could be 115, no clue.

Leads me through some stud walled hallways to a darkened bedroom with not much in it but a massage table. Or at least a table I was going to lie on. Naked Please.

Were you scared G?
At that time in my life I was extremely self confident in almost every way, that coupled with my belief at the time that there was a pretty good chance I may have been the outright toughest man on the planet at that time allowed me to stay chill.

So just to calm you fucking perverts down nothing funky happened.

If you have every had deep tissue massage or any of the myofascial release techniques that we are discussing here it was basically the same stuff. I don't think he used any instruments, I've had a bunch of these types of treatments over the years and if money was no object I'd go for a deep tissue massage of some sort every 10 days.

So it was those types of techniques but no-one has every done it with anywhere near that intensity since. It, nor similar treatments since, are not like that couples massage you had with the pretty music and warm rocks placed gently on your back.

It's an athletic event that needs a name that describes it as "try to stay completely relaxed so a man can try to emulsify every bit of soft skeletal tissue on your body in the most painful overload of all of your senses that you may ever experience" My tongue was spasming and would have sworn at the time that there was death metal playing at 11 the entire time.
Ha, ha, ha, ha, thats how I felt when I went to my girl the first time. The pain. I think the work pain she has inflicted on me was pecs. I almost tapped out on that one but didn’t want to look like a pussy.
Now that things are loosed up, its not painful anymore.
 
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