Do I use a small shot of Humalog with Hgh am before fasted cardio with Injectable carnitine?

Synyster

Synyster

Well-known member
Trusted Member
Upcoming cycle will include hgh... Insulin... And inj l carnitine among other things.

Focusing very much on fat loss in the first half of the day.

Planning to take my 2iu of hgh upon waking and start cardio about 20 min later. Would like to take inj l carnitine also before am fasted cardio but I'm a believer in taking a small 2 or 3iu shot of slin just before the inj l carnitine.
But in my mind this will negate the fasted environment for the hgh to really affect fat loss.

I'm also planning to take more inj lcarnitine preworkout with a small slin shot again but no hgh there. My entire hgh dose was going to be am fasted pre cardio.

What do you guys suggest I do?
-Save hgh for another time like preworkout or before bed
-do It above as planned and stop worrying
-do the hgh and Inj lcarnitine am fasted without slin
Another option

Thanks for your time
 
I've seen and heard of athletes taking slin pre fasted cardio as well. Absolutely retarded in my opinion. Don't do it if you like having brain cells. 1iu maybe some can get away without going hypo, but its just not worth the risk to reward ratio.

Hgh pre fasted cardio is enough. Take some eca for a extra fat burning effect if need be. Use that slin when it's refeeding time post workout or don't use it at all. Unless you're super in tune with your bodies response to insulin. I'd highly recommend using a live bgl monitor if you're actually considering this.
 
If you are fasted, it will not hinder fat loss at all. Naturally, insulin usually hinder fat loss because if its in your blood, your body won't produce HGH and therefore fatty acids won't be released for usage in your blood. If you inject the HGH, insulin have no effect that way. That being said, introducing slin to your protocal as you described should not have any benefits, only risk of going hypo for nothing...
 
Insulin blunts gh, GH blunts slin.
Dont do this option you have laid out man....
I underst5and the thought process, thinking slin will carry out any extra blood sugar etc in the am. It wont work like that. Some do it preworkout slin injection, with very little carbs, due to the fact exercise will release glucose to the blood stream, and exercise does this for energy etc releasing glucose storage. BUT many of them have issues in doing this and it is not a great idea IMHO.
 
Your idea isn't crazy or completely off base, but it's also not safe therefore I'm not going to offer advice on how I would approach it. My advice will be not to. Slin while fasted combined with cardio could be a recipe for disaster if even the slightest thing goes sideways.
 
IronRobi said:
Your idea isn't crazy or completely off base, but it's also not safe therefore I'm not going to offer advice on how I would approach it. My advice will be not to. Slin while fasted combined with cardio could be a recipe for disaster if even the slightest thing goes sideways.
Click to expand...
I'm with you on this.
I have heard of doing this but I don't think it's worth the net results
 
Id take 1 scoop of efx karbolyn with 2 to 3 units of huma and your l carnitine. That gives you 50 fast carbs with a fairly safe buffer of only 2 to 3 units of slin. So roughly 1:25 ratio or 1:16 but we dont know your baseline insulin or your insulin sensitivity state, most likely why no one will give you the go ahead.

insulin is pretty simple once you understand what you need on a fasted state vs A fully carbed state ect experiment with fast carbs like karbolyn first to figure out your ratio is my best advise, and buy lots of strips for your glucose monitor

I use lantus and huma together.
 
Harley00 said:
Id take 1 scoop of efx karbolyn with 2 to 3 units of huma and your l carnitine. That gives you 50 fast carbs with a fairly safe buffer of only 2 to 3 units of slin. So roughly 1:25 ratio or 1:16 but we dont know your baseline insulin or your insulin sensitivity state, most likely why no one will give you the go ahead.

insulin is pretty simple once you understand what you need on a fasted state vs A fully carbed state ect experiment with fast carbs like karbolyn first to figure out your ratio is my best advise, and buy lots of strips for your glucose monitor

I use lantus and huma together.
Click to expand...
This is also how you get fat.
Take too many carbs "for safety"


Also he is talking about doing fasted cardio with slin. Add karbolyn you are no longer fasted
 
Harley00 said:
Id take 1 scoop of efx karbolyn with 2 to 3 units of huma and your l carnitine. That gives you 50 fast carbs with a fairly safe buffer of only 2 to 3 units of slin. So roughly 1:25 ratio or 1:16 but we dont know your baseline insulin or your insulin sensitivity state, most likely why no one will give you the go ahead.

insulin is pretty simple once you understand what you need on a fasted state vs A fully carbed state ect experiment with fast carbs like karbolyn first to figure out your ratio is my best advise, and buy lots of strips for your glucose monitor

I use lantus and huma together.
Click to expand...
Awesome
 
3ml said:
This is also how you get fat.
Take too many carbs "for safety"


Also he is talking about doing fasted cardio with slin. Add karbolyn you are no longer fasted
Click to expand...
I understand what he is talking about, and i do not agree with fasted slin, unless there is a insulin resistance issue etc.

I also dont agree with getting fat from slin if your putting in the work. L cart works better with the rasie in insulin, in this scenario we do not know if he could take slin and be fine, so i was given what id do to benifit from the l cart and still see results, and being safe as one can.
 
Harley00 said:
I understand what he is talking about, and i do not agree with fasted slin, unless there is a insulin resistance issue etc.

I also dont agree with getting fat from slin if your putting in the work. L cart works better with the rasie in insulin, in this scenario we do not know if he could take slin and be fine, so i was given what id do to benifit from the l cart and still see results, and being safe as one can.
Click to expand...

You definitely for sure can get fat off slin, regardless of how much work you put in.

Insulin isn’t exclusive to skeletal muscle. Adipose tissue is HIGHLY responsive to insulin. If you drive excessive carbs to adipose tissue, what do you expect to happen?

Also, overeating to keep BG levels higher while on insulin completely and totally defeats the purpose of using insulin. Even though it’s safe, not only are you defeating the entire purpose but this is also the best recipe to getting fat as @3ml stated.

I get the theory of using a low dose of insulin pre fasted cardio to help drive BG to the cells, because the blood glucose would be derived from adipose tissue in a fasted state therefor increasing the efficiency of your fat burn. Once you consume carbs, the blood glucose you are shutting is no longer derived from adipose tissue but is derived from digested carbohydrates - which not only completely offsets the intended use of the insulin but now your also doing cardio just to burn calories that you unnecessarily consumed just to burn calories doing cardio - making your cardio a complete and total waste of time

The most effective and safest guide to using insulin is as it’s intended in a therapeutic setting with diabetics. In a growth phase, high amounts of carbohydrates may not be partitioned properly because of an insufficient insulin response. Eating 600 grams of carbs a day isn’t necessarily normal and likely you will experience high fasted BG levels because your body doesn’t create enough insulin to partition this amount of nutrients. Blood glucose levels start increasing and it’s a very taxing load on your beta cells of the pancreas which create and secrete insulin.

Deploying an exogenous insulin in this case not only utilized the high carbohydrate amount, but also reduces taxing load on your beta cells of your pancreas - preventing a decrease in beta cell function and even possibly diabetes.

we could talk about insulin deployment to bring down heightened fasted blood glucose levels so that he’s maintaining an efficient fasted blood glucose level prior to fasted cardio

but frankly I don’t think that most people on the board are ready for that conversation, nor do I think that someone won’t come along and read it and take it totally out of context and go pin 30 units of lantus and go fasted cardio with nothing but water in the fridge and kill themselves

so short answer, forget about the fucking insulin OP. Use a little Metformin before bed so your waking up in a good fasted BG range. If that’s still not fixing it, cut the carbs. Your dieting for fuck sake this is the easiest time to get fasted BG under control.

Your solution is to take insulin to reduce BG instead of simply just cutting carbs before bed to reduce fasted serum BG? Don’t be lazy. I mean your asking for insulin advice and you can’t even tell us a fasted BG number? Cmon man.
 
Harley00 said:
Id take 1 scoop of efx karbolyn with 2 to 3 units of huma and your l carnitine. That gives you 50 fast carbs with a fairly safe buffer of only 2 to 3 units of slin. So roughly 1:25 ratio or 1:16 but we dont know your baseline insulin or your insulin sensitivity state, most likely why no one will give you the go ahead.

insulin is pretty simple once you understand what you need on a fasted state vs A fully carbed state ect experiment with fast carbs like karbolyn first to figure out your ratio is my best advise, and buy lots of strips for your glucose monitor

I use lantus and huma together.
Click to expand...
Not a good approach, you will gain fat doing this EVERY time. Been there done that. You do not want extra carbs, they get shuttled and can cause excess fat, and shit feelings.

The OP has a decent thought, and as i mentioned above, i understand it, and have done it. I will say the net gains were not worth the shit feelings and on edge wondering..."Is this too much weakness, am i crashing, Should i take some glucose asap. "
It was not worth the tiny extra IMHO.
It can work as mentioned by scavenging glucose the body releases during work. BUT....
 
Harley00 said:
I understand what he is talking about, and i do not agree with fasted slin, unless there is a insulin resistance issue etc.

I also dont agree with getting fat from slin if your putting in the work. L cart works better with the rasie in insulin, in this scenario we do not know if he could take slin and be fine, so i was given what id do to benifit from the l cart and still see results, and being safe as one can.
Click to expand...
work utilizes glycogen over a period of time, quite a long time, Slin utilizes it instantly and stores excess, you will then get fat, and fell like shit during this process.
 
ironwill said:
Not a good approach, you will gain fat doing this EVERY time. Been there done that. You do not want extra carbs, they get shuttled and can cause excess fat, and shit feelings.

The OP has a decent thought, and as i mentioned above, i understand it, and have done it. I will say the net gains were not worth the shit feelings and on edge wondering..."Is this too much weakness, am i crashing, Should i take some glucose asap. "
It was not worth the tiny extra IMHO.
It can work as mentioned by scavenging glucose the body releases during work. BUT....
Click to expand...
I understand, but i was more on the note that if he is going to try it, then its best to find his ratio, and see how he reacts , so using a small amount of fast carbs would give him a small saftey.

I do not eat alot of carbs my self, i carb cycle and take carbs when needed, sometimes thats pre workout and sometimes its post, depends on the day and the net carbs previous days and the workout. If your watching your carbs and using slin properly i think in certain scenarios it can be beneficial and used properly i dunno if your going to see a huge fat mass, if your a low carb diet and your putting the work in i think you will be ok, im not talking shoving 300 carbs in you, my daily carbs would be 100 to 150.

I was helping the op with a way to get introduced with slin. And fast carbs works well to find your ratio.
 
Cumminstech2 said:
You definitely for sure can get fat off slin, regardless of how much work you put in.

Insulin isn’t exclusive to skeletal muscle. Adipose tissue is HIGHLY responsive to insulin. If you drive excessive carbs to adipose tissue, what do you expect to happen?

Also, overeating to keep BG levels higher while on insulin completely and totally defeats the purpose of using insulin. Even though it’s safe, not only are you defeating the entire purpose but this is also the best recipe to getting fat as @3ml stated.

I get the theory of using a low dose of insulin pre fasted cardio to help drive BG to the cells, because the blood glucose would be derived from adipose tissue in a fasted state therefor increasing the efficiency of your fat burn. Once you consume carbs, the blood glucose you are shutting is no longer derived from adipose tissue but is derived from digested carbohydrates - which not only completely offsets the intended use of the insulin but now your also doing cardio just to burn calories that you unnecessarily consumed just to burn calories doing cardio - making your cardio a complete and total waste of time

The most effective and safest guide to using insulin is as it’s intended in a therapeutic setting with diabetics. In a growth phase, high amounts of carbohydrates may not be partitioned properly because of an insufficient insulin response. Eating 600 grams of carbs a day isn’t necessarily normal and likely you will experience high fasted BG levels because your body doesn’t create enough insulin to partition this amount of nutrients. Blood glucose levels start increasing and it’s a very taxing load on your beta cells of the pancreas which create and secrete insulin.

Deploying an exogenous insulin in this case not only utilized the high carbohydrate amount, but also reduces taxing load on your beta cells of your pancreas - preventing a decrease in beta cell function and even possibly diabetes.

we could talk about insulin deployment to bring down heightened fasted blood glucose levels so that he’s maintaining an efficient fasted blood glucose level prior to fasted cardio

but frankly I don’t think that most people on the board are ready for that conversation, nor do I think that someone won’t come along and read it and take it totally out of context and go pin 30 units of lantus and go fasted cardio with nothing but water in the fridge and kill themselves

so short answer, forget about the fucking insulin OP. Use a little Metformin before bed so your waking up in a good fasted BG range. If that’s still not fixing it, cut the carbs. Your dieting for fuck sake this is the easiest time to get fasted BG under control.

Your solution is to take insulin to reduce BG instead of simply just cutting carbs before bed to reduce fasted serum BG? Don’t be lazy. I mean your asking for insulin advice and you can’t even tell us a fasted BG number? Cmon man.Pretty
Click to expand...

Good post, one thing though. Glucose is not derived from adipose tissue, it is derived while fasted via stored glucose in muscle first, then liver stores, then it turns to protein. Fat cannot be converted to glucose, only protein and glucose can do this.
Your body needs to turn to burning fat as an energy source to burn fat, not turn fat to glucose etc.
I wouldn't state MOST people on this board do not understand BG release into the blood stream. IN FACT MANY of us have been there, done that a LONG ass time ago, learned and moved on. The younger folks maybe, but there are a ton of oldtimers on here that have forgotten more than some will ever know from experiences and trials while UG labs were coming in to vogue status, many of us did experiments for our Labs as they came into Canada.

I like your posts Cumminstech, BUT, you do try to come off as an expert IMHO, but do still have much to learn.

I have never spoke or typed on nor responded to something to give advice like an old baller, when i was still learning, that is dangerous, and you could lose integrity quickly with your peers'.

Do what you want, i see you as a knowledgeable fellow, linked in to learn and understand. Just slow the role a bit on STATEMENTS, and follow up with, IMO, or IMHO etc, this does not leave you o sound like you are an OG guru, which takes a long time, and you MAY get there, but are not there yet brother.
I am not being rude, nor disrespectful and we all have knowledge and learn, just format your replies to leave some openings for educating yourself as well.

That is my opinion and mean no disrespect, i dont have much of a filter and write with respect, not arrogance or with ego.
 
Harley00 said:
I understand, but i was more on the note that if he is going to try it, then its best to find his ratio, and see how he reacts , so using a small amount of fast carbs would give him a small saftey.

I do not eat alot of carbs my self, i carb cycle and take carbs when needed, sometimes thats pre workout and sometimes its post, depends on the day and the net carbs previous days and the workout. If your watching your carbs and using slin properly i think in certain scenarios it can be beneficial and used properly i dunno if your going to see a huge fat mass, if your a low carb diet and your putting the work in i think you will be ok, im not talking shoving 300 carbs in you, my daily carbs would be 100 to 150.

I was helping the op with a way to get introduced with slin. And fast carbs works well to find your ratio.
Click to expand...
Yeah man, i am not cutting ya down, i know what you were doing. I get it and that is the correct approach to initially using slin, have more on hand than required. Then adjust as you go down the road of learning.
Good approach for sure, BUT fasted slin is NOT for a newbie learning slin. So i agree with what you were doing brother, protecting him and trying to teach a bit.
 
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